Making money at WorldWinner

[ematty19]

Hi all,

I've played at king.com for a while now and have done quite well on there. In the past I have tried to do the same on WorldWinner, but have always found it a lot more difficult! Infact I made a loss there. With the tax on winnings, and some really solid players does anyone have any tips as to the best way to make a profit there e.g. get really good in one game. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

[dpaull414]

Hi all,

I've played at king.com for a while now and have done quite well on there. In the past I have tried to do the same on WorldWinner, but have always found it a lot more difficult! Infact I made a loss there. With the tax on winnings, and some really solid players does anyone have any tips as to the best way to make a profit there e.g. get really good in one game. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

Ladders can be profitable because you get to pick your opponents. Just pick people you know you can beat. Even in games you aren't good at you can typically find people even worse that you can beat. With the amount of activity on ladders you won't get rich, but if you want to play games and make a little money it's possible.

My belief/experience is that if you are profitable tho, you will face increasingly difficult competition until finally you get matched against the very best players. And that can happen really fast too.

King is awesome because you start off at that low 2000 skill ranking and you can typically beat up on the competition at that level. And quite possibly at that next level too. In WW you get thrown to the elite gamers really fast.

Survivals CAN be profitable too. They are open skill division (no fairmatching). If you try one, make a spreadsheet and track your profitability to make sure it's worthwhile. For what it's worth, I know time of day and day of week matter in survival. I think some of it has to do with when the players that play those games work. I like playing luxor survival during the day because I tend to get more favorable matchups. At night the elite will tend to be online.

Personally I only play 36+ player cash games. I hate 1 winner games because it's just too easy to lose those! Everybody is different, but if you are looking at learning a game, pick a game that has 36/50/75/100 player tournaments.

[Jacob]

For WorldWinner, I have to admit that it can be difficult to be profitable over the course of playing numerous games on there. Other than getting "lucky" and being able to put up a high score against players who didn't perform as well in a high stakes game, you just have to know when to back off from playing when your rank gets too high. It seems to me that the ranking system on WorldWinner is very elastic, whereby you can hit the top ranks relatively quickly with a streak of wins.

Also, yeah -- playing those 36 player cash games kind of helps your odds with being profitable if you're able to put up a good score in game on a somewhat consistent basis.

[ematty19]

Thanks for the tips. I agree, the ranking system makes it difficult to be profitable, unless you're really exceptional at a game. I've found that because I am quite good at games in general my ranking just sky rockets on WorldWinner and i'm quickly playing against the top level and more experienced gamers. It's a shame because I enjoy playing for higher stakes, but I guess that is why king.com is so successful.

[Renaldo Moon]

Hi all,

I've played at king.com for a while now and have done quite well on there. In the past I have tried to do the same on WorldWinner, but have always found it a lot more difficult! Infact I made a loss there. With the tax on winnings, and some really solid players does anyone have any tips as to the best way to make a profit there e.g. get really good in one game. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

We have a whole lot of Worldwinner game guides available here, but I don't think we've ever put up a profiting guide.

The dynamics of Worldwinner's competition is drastically different than King's-- it's not nearly so linear. The strategy behind the competition is usually more complex than the game itself-- but in any game you have a few options, a few different opportunities to seize, and it's about seizing the right opportunities that'll end up making a profit-- just like at a casino, if you jump at any opportunity you're going to see a net loss over time.

What games do you try to play on there? Check out your peer-base in those games. How are the people in your skill division scoring? There are two important data to look for here-- What are the high scores in your division, and what are the consistent scores in your division? If you check out the daily delights, specials, or 20+ player games, the scores you're going to see at the top are inflated. Those are the scores that, after 5 or 10 tries, your peers were able to score. This will give you a rough idea of what a strong score is for your division. Check the consistency of your peers' scores by checking out a couple smaller games (3, 5, 7 player games.) Are your peers consistently scoring higher than you?

For instance, in my Bejeweled division, people score about 6,500-7,000 consistently. I can't do that. My consistent scores are around 4,500-5,000. However, when I do break 6,500, it's usually by a lot. I have a much higher frequency of 10,000+ scores than others in Division II, but I'm not likely to beat an opponent if we each play only one round.

If you follow that same suit, that you go all-or-nothing and either score high or botch it, then your best opportunity for profit is in the larger games, where with 3 or 4 tries you can put up a score that's pretty certain to win.

If you can't do that, but can consistently get OK scores, then that's still a strength you can use to your advantage. In the smaller competitions, people don't have the opportunity to enter 5 times to get a strong score. So for those guys who can put up 7,000 in WW Bejeweled every game, I stand no chance against them in the smaller tournaments, so I'm disadvantaged playing there. If you do the $1 games, you're also at the advantage that many people won't care to fight over chump change, and the competition is a little more lax. Take it seriously, and you can swoop up the free money that's floating around there. It might sound similar to a dog begging for table-scraps, but hey, it's money.

As for ladders, a lot of people join the ladders and forget about it, so you'll challenge them and have to wait a day just to get a refund. You'll take their spot though, and if you can move up in the ladder to the top 50, there's a lot of activity there (and though "top 50" might sound like you're playing against the top dogs, that's not true at all. Most top players won't bother with the ladders, and those that do will stick in the top 10 or 20. 20-50 are the players who are just a bit under and want to break into the top 15 in the ladder so they can get the rewards points. If you hang out around this spot, in the top 20 or 30, activity seems to spike up a lot, and you'll get challenges pretty frequently. If you're a consistent player, and can put up a pretty good score regularly, it's easy pickins here-- $1.15 per win, but with 2 or 3 wins a day you'll be making a bit of cash. Take into account you'll lose on occasion, but if you keep a 2:1 win ratio in the ladder, you'll come out ahead. As a top player in Scrabble Cubes and Wheel of Fortune, and an alright player in Big Money, I'd do this and have ladder challenges almost every time I logged on, which was like every 2 hours. Even though I was one of the top Scrabble Cubers, and the people challenging me knew that, they'd still blast me with challenges, like "Oh ho ho! I'll get you sooner or later!" and they eventually would, and they'd take my spot, but I'd make like $5 or $10 before they would, so I was happy with that trade.

Similarly, if you're not a consistent player, try to avoid the ladders.

Consistency also depends on the game a lot too-- Some games, if you try to put up an overwhelming score, you'll have to risk getting a terrible score in the process. This plays into the strategy a lot too. In many games, you'll have to make very crucial decisions which may make or break your score.

In scrabble cubes for instance, sometimes I'd see a 7-letter word laying about, but if I take it, it'd use up the triple-letter cube, which isn't fully revealed and might have a Z on it. If it does have a Z on it, it'd be a devastating mistake to use it up for a 7-letter bingo. At this point, there are about 5 thoughts that are running through my mind:

Am I playing a large competition or a small one? Even a premium counts as a small one, as long as it only has a few entry slots.

If I'm playing a large competition, like a special or a 100-player, I know that it won't matter what score I get unless it's a really strong score (1000+ for SC.) I'll look at my current pace and score, and see about how well I'm doing. If I'm doing well, I won't break my chance on a risky gamble. If I'm doing OK, and I know that only that triple letter Z would land me the high score, then I'd better gamble it and see if it's there or not. If it is, I'll probably win. If it's not, then I wouldn't have won either way.

Knowing your competition is really important too. I know the play style and expected scores of all my Scrabble Cubes peers, and I know that, if I'm in a small game, we're all getting the same layout. I'll have to consider what Rahnnyboy is thinking as he's playing the same layout, and the same for Bmy. I know that Rahnny's a sucker for triple-letter cubes, and wouldn't hesitate for a second to reveal that triple-letter Z. I know Bmy's a little more conservative. I know also that they both have a much larger vocabulary than me, which is essential to Scrabble Cubes. I'll have to consider, if that Z is there, they'll know 100 ways to use it while I might not find anything. I know that my strengths in Scrabble Cubes lies in very strict principles I've developed which are long and extraordinarily boring, but are in the guides section if you want them explained. This could mean that if I stick to that 7-letter word, I'll put up a pretty strong score while Rahn/Bmy took a different route that was less generous.

So really, I'm looking at my own strengths, comparing them to my opponent's strengths, taking consideration into the type of competition we're playing, and opportunizing in whatever way I can. The same goes for all the games I played on there.

If this sounds like a complicated headache, it is. Playing for money on Worldwinner takes any fun that ever was in the games out of it. Any time money's involved, the field gets very, very saturated and everyone's looking for a way to get an edge up on the competition, which drives the competition to a very steep learning curve and creates a barrier for newer players, and eventually the saturation is so thick that everyone's losing money since it's 8 or 10 people continuously rotating money around each other, while Worldwinner takes a nominal fee each time it switches hands. If this doesn't sound like something you'd want to do, then you probably shouldn't do it past, perhaps, the low ranks and opportunizing on those ladders, which are a little unsaturated because they take a lot of time and effort for little payout. But it's easy payout.

It's pretty comparable to playing poker. Go out and have a $10 buy-in for poker night with your friends, have a few drinks, and you'll have a blast. Try going to the casino and playing hold em' against people who are very, very serious and conservative about their money, and you'll spend 12 hours there running on stress and adrenaline and, if you played very very wisely, you'll come out with maybe a hundred bucks and a terrible headache. If you want to profit on worldwinner, stick to the low-key stuff, don't even try to head into the top ranks and compete. You'll get stress and anxiety and high blood pressure while you're 20 years old like I did, all to come out with barely 5-figures for the whole financial year. That might sound nice for extra income, but the time and dedication it takes to even do that takes all your time, which you'd make a lot more if you worked a part time job in that spare time instead, and even if you're already working a full-time job, you'd be under less stress and get more sleep with a second job than on Worldwinner-- Unless you live for the rush of adrenaline that comes with high-stakes gambling, in which case, go wild.

Play that low-key stuff and make an extra $30-$50/month. That takes very little effort to do, and is probably the only consistent profit you'll make. Don't take extra chances exploring unknown territory in other games, just stick to what you know you can win.

What I should have mentioned before-- If you can't get either occasional high scores or consistent decent scores, just practice a bunch and ask questions here. You'll get better by exposing yourself to the game through practice though. The theory you'll find in the strategy guides here is great, but unless you're familiar enough with the game to integrate it into your gameplay fluidly, it won't help you. Experience will.

I know that's a long and rambling post, but if you have any more questions, feel free to ask. That's what we're here for.

[dpaull414]

That is an awesome post that I agree with completely. Thank u so much for taking the time to post it!

I'd only add one thing.. I know when I started playing dynomite and entering the 36+ player tournaments or the daily, you have to play the crazy aggressive blind bankshot technique. My stress levels would go way up as I'd enter over and over hoping for the sweet setup, or even within a game sometimes. For example if I was 4 minutes into a game you know you are running out of time and if everything is working well you're anticipating the big drop. But you just don't know if you'll get it done in time. Heck, my heart beat would go nuts and my hands would start to shake and it would make playing difficult. I'm sure I lost plenty of times because of my inability to control that stress. I'm also sure if I entered a premium right now I'd have the same issue with stress until I got used to it!

But after doing it for several months & knowing based on past experience I'd be profitable, the stress level went way way down. Now I just play and have little stress because unless the game changes, the player mix changes, or my abilities decline, I know I'll win money. No stress in that.

We have a whole lot of Worldwinner game guides available here, but I don't think we've ever put up a profiting guide.

The dynamics of Worldwinner's competition is drastically different than King's-- it's not nearly so linear. .......

[ematty19]

Thanks for the detailed reply, it was very helpful.

I always thought that WorldWinner was a gaming site with a potentially great profit making opportunity, but the more I play there and hear from experierienced gamers there I see that this is generally not the case.

I had never played games like Big Money before, but after very few (~ 20+) games I have already been placed in rank division 1 (this has been the case in many other games that are new to me, where I am in rank division 2 already)! I least I think i'm in these ranks, as I don't really play on the site much i'm not sure how to check - I just based it on which level progressive I am in for each game, would this indicate my rank?

I score fairly well in Big Money (hard) 9/10, but it still doesn't make sense to me as the scores I am coming up against now are scores that are unattainable to me. After all it doesn't matter if you're good at a game when the people you are up against are better. Yes, after spending some more money I might be moved down a divison, to a point where I can try to break even, but that doesn't sound worthwhile. As you pointed out ladders are good opportunity to make a steady income if your are consistently above average in a game, but personally it's not really what I was after. I believe WorldWinner could do with more ranks than just 4, but what do I know?

Poker is something I enjoy a lot and my return on investment (ROI) is generally very good and consistent. I was even getting sponsored after I finished uni last year while I was in the process of looking for a graduate job. I really enjoyed it and was making about £1400-£2000 a month, which I had to half with my sponsor (Badbeat.com), but I found myself spending too much time on the computer entering tournaments that could last for many hours and end in lots of frustration!!

I think I'm going to just concentrate on playing King.com in my spare time and a bit of poker too, and maybe play WorldWinner occasionally when I fancy more of a gamble!